Full transcript of 'The Newsmaker' with DFA Secretary Enrique Manalo, February 27, 2025

Metro Manila, Philippines - Amid tensions in the West Philippine Sea and the Trump administration's America First policy, how does the Philippines navigate relations with China and its treaty ally?

Foreign Affairs Secretary Enrique Manalo sat down with our Senior Correspondent and Anchor Tristan Nodalo and dissected the issues in this episode of "The Newsmaker."

Here's the full transcript:

INTERVIEWER: Thank you for joining us. I am Tristan Nodalo and joining us in this exclusive edition of ‘The Newsmaker’ is Foreign Affairs Secretary Enrique Manalo. Secretary Manalo, thank you for granting this interview.

MANALO: Thank you for having me.

INTERVIEWER: Okay. Sir, simulan na po natin. Let's begin with one of the pressing concerns. You once described the situation in the West Philippine Sea as a primary security challenge. And tensions have escalated in recent months with China doing dangerous maneuvers not only to Philippine vessels, but now including aircraft, sir. So given these developments at sea, how would you describe our relations with China?

MANALO: Well, our relations with China are basically, are really quite complex. I think I've said this before, it's not only a relationship based on the, let's's say the situation of the South China Sea. We have a long economic relationship. China remains our number one trading partner. We have cultural exchanges. We still have a lot of people-to-people ties. So it's a very broad and complex relationship. But even given that though, as you mentioned, the tensions in the South China Sea remain and the situation remains a security challenge to the Philippines in the sense that what is being challenged is not only our rights to use the resources and to take advantage of resources within our exclusive economic zone, but also our sovereignty and sovereign rights as laid and set forth in the UN Convention on the Law of the Sea. Our ability to assert our rights and take advantage of them. So all those together make this certainly a challenge for us.

INTERVIEWER: One noticeable feature of the Marcos administration strategy in the West Philippine Sea is what they call as transparency initiative, sir- exposing China's behavior in the area. And it also gained international support from other allied countries. But do you think this is helping in countering China's aggression or is it making the situation worse?

MANALO: I think it helps because as you mentioned, by creating greater transparency, more countries and governments become aware of the situation. So every time there's an incident, we would publicize it either through video or through other means. So nakikita ng mga ibang governments. And as you know, on many occasions, many governments came out with statements in support of the Philippines and basically supporting our right to be wherever that incident occurred and that what we were doing was within our legal rights. So I think the, I believe the transparency initiative works because it gives greater traction or greater publicity to what's happening and people can see with their very eyes. And here, there really has been an incident that it's not fabricated or based on simply written communications. You can actually see it and hear it. So I think in that sense, it has certainly been very helpful, at least in bringing the true situation out.

INTERVIEWER: Okay, international support. But every time, sir, there is an incident happening at sea, these countries that we can name are the same countries, sir, who keep on supporting the Philippines. But there are observations also that, what about our Southeast Asia neighbors? Or for you, sir, do you think we should work more or exert more effort to convince more countries to join us in this cause when we are exposing this type of behaviors?

MANALO: Well, obviously, it's up to each country whether they want to speak out. In the case of ASEAN, we, of course, are working through the ASEAN as a group. And we have come up, of course, with many statements. But we're also in touch with a number of our partners in ASEAN, especially the claimant states. And I think we've had very good discussions with them. So, in terms of, you know, disputed areas. So, naturally, we will continue to stress our views and our points on this. But again, ultimately,it's up to any country whether they wish to say it. What I can say, and I said this before, we have not received any word of any country opposing or criticizing our moves, our rights, our activities there, except for one.

INTERVIEWER: Okay. But Secretary, I want to ask, the most recent incident that, you know, it's in the news, the Chinese helicopter moving as close as 300 meters to Philippine aircraft over Scarborough Shoal, that basically endangered those on board. Did we file a protest on that particular incident? And what's next, sir? Given this, parang sobrang lapit na nung pangyayarihan Sabi nga ni Coast Guard sir eh Talagang worst case scenario ang pwedeng mangyari doon.

MANALO: Well of course we were deeply disturbed. We issued not only a protest but a statement, I think there were two statements issued And not only by DFA but I think the National Maritime Council. We were deeply disturbed by this incident because, well, obviously it was a reckless disregard for safety. And that helicopter coming so close to a flight, which had every right to be there, certainly is disconcerting. Because, you know, maybe just a few more meters closer or another meter closer, you'll have had an accident. And an unavoidable accident was done on purpose to this maneuver. So in other words, it was a very dangerous maneuver and not in line or consistent with the procedures which are normal in terms of flying aircraft. So naturally, we're concerned with that kind of action.

INTERVIEWER: Did we use our hotline, sir, that was discussed during the bilateral consultative mechanism?

MANALO: For this particular occasion, I don't think we used a hotline. Technically, it wasn't on the sea. But I don't think there was a need to use the hotline. I think it was known around the world and the photos came out, and I don't see what else you could say. And we made the protest so it was pretty clear that in this state, in this particular incident, we certainly had every right to complain and we complained through various means.

INTERVIEWER: Tensions have been increasing in Scarborough Shoal or Bajo de Masinloc in recent months, sir. With China deploying more assets in that particular shoal, they even sent a map to the United Nations claiming that it's part of their territorial waters. So, are you at all concerned on China's real plan over Scarborough Shoal and do we have any means to stop them from doing, let's say, building an island over Scarborough and Bajo de Masinloc?

MANALO: Well, you know, first of all, we have, we've already indicated our concerns on this development. First of all, it's only China which considers that area within its maritime zone. Even if they gave a map, no other country has come out in support of that. And we certainly are not going to be one of them since that falls within our sovereign rights, that area. And what's most disconcerting here is that in this area, our rights to use that are now being challenged on the basis of what China calls its own law. And we will consistently not agree to that view. We will consistently not agree to that view. We will consistently assert our legal rights in accordance with international law. And I think other countries who wish to do so are free to join us. I think no other country has recognized China's claim. And we, again, we receive support on our view. So I think we will continue to do that. As you know, our position too has also been consistent that we wish to settle these disputes through diplomatic means. And that's the way that we are going to pursue these events. But we will consistently speak out with our partners and in relevant forum.

INTERVIEWER: Sir, President Marcos said last year that China's red light is when a Filipino is willfully killed.

MANALO: You mean the Philippine red line?

INTERVIEWER: Yeah, the red line, sir, is when a Filipino is wilfully killed in the South China Sea. But given the recent developments, even after that statement, do you think China is testing the waters on whether we are serious about that red line and whether the commitments of our allied countries would materialize?

MANALO: Well, you know, that's always the danger. That if there's an incident, something could happen which will elevate or raise the tensions or even create a situation where you reach into the next level. And that's something that we're trying of course to avoid. But that's our concern. The more these incidents occur, the greater the risk that at one point something may happen beyond the control of either party. In other words, an accident. And therefore, like in the case of the helicopter, there had been a mistake by the pilot of the helicopter and there could have been an incident. So I think these are the things that we are concerned about. That's why we feel it's important that we have talks to see how we can, at any time, have talks or through diplomatic talks to see how we can ease tensions and prevent situations from escalating into something more. So this is always the concern that we have.

INTERVIEWER: And siguro, sir, baka yung mga kababayan po natin, whenever they hear the story, another incident, another diplomatic protest, for Filipinos, sir, how would they understand the value of this protest, yung ginagawa po ng DFA pagdating sa mga ganitong incident.

MANALO: Itong mga incidents, nag-protest tayo, not only through a note verbal. A note verbal is sent through the embassy. Nag-i-issue din tayo ng statement. And then sometimes we, on occasion, we've used the hotline. So there are many ways of protesting. Ang importante sa note verbal is that the incident is put on record. And in the note verbal, the specific incident, what happened, our concern, the dangers, it's all there. So there's a clear written record. So if you wish to refer to that in the future, you will have something clearly on record. And then normally, sa note verbal, it expect mo na mag-reply then yung the other country. Doon sa note, most likely, in another note. So, their reply is also recorded. So, that is the big advantage of a note we're about because it's on the record. Tsaka may history ka kung ano nangyari. And whereas, if you didn't give a note, then, you know, they could, a year later, they could deny, no, that never happened.

INTERVIEWER: So, things like that. Parang hindi, sabi nga po po, then ng DFA, sabi nyo rin po before, na parang hindi pakitang nanahimik tayo over that particular incident.

MANALO: Yeah, and of course, we will make record that we did speak. We did say something on that.

INTERVIEWER: Okay. Secretary Manalo, while the situation in Scarborough Shoal is getting tense and in other areas of West Philippine Sea, it's relatively, how would I say, relatively quiet in Ayungin Shoal every time there's a resupply mission of the provisional deal that we have with China regarding Ayungin Shoal. But there are calls for its termination. Retired Supreme Court Justice Antonio Carpio said that we should not allow this deal to prolong because this might give an impression to China that we are giving consent to them. And they said that it should not expand to other areas of West Philippine Sea. What is your take on this?

MANALO: Well, obviously I agree with what you said that it has been relatively quiet. The last three or four supply missions have proceeded without any incident. And that, of course, is directly related to the provisional understanding that we reached with China. Now, this was two-way. This was not a request from the Philippines. It was both sides felt that maybe one way of dealing with this escalating tensions would be to have some kind of understanding. Kasi dati before they were saying there's a so-called gentleman's agreement. We never saw such an agreement. It was never in writing. So we have a provisional understanding which, and please note the word provisional, and in this provisional understanding it was made clear that none of the positions of either country would be affected. So in other words, ang position natin is maintained. And therefore, whatever we were saying regarding our sovereign rights along Ayungin Shoal, remains. And was not affected by the understanding. All the understanding did was create conditions whereby the supply missions could proceed peacefully. Unlike before, there were no rules of engagement, so nagkakaroon ng incidents. So in that way, the understanding has been helpful. And as you can see, our ship is still there, our assets are still being provided for, humanitarian missions basically, those are the missions, humanitarian are proceeding without any incident providing water and food. So, I think all the things that we had wanted actually are being done.

INTERVIEWER: If this is working, are you open to expanding this deal to other features of the West Philippine Sea?

MANALO: Well, you know, that depends on the issue. You can't really close the door, but we have to see. As I said, the Ayungin Shoal understanding was both countries felt that maybe it might be useful to look into it. So before you proceed, you have to be sure that the other side is also willing. But as I said, at the moment I'm only speculating. It all depends on how situations develop. But you know, you shouldn't we don't want to detract from our main mission of certainly addressing issues through diplomatic means.

INTERVIEWER: Okay. earlier, sir, in your opening statement and in your first answer, Sir, you've mentioned that our relations with China is complicated or complex to describe it. Because, not only the security, because we also have our economic ties with Beijing. How difficult is it to balance that relations? And at the same time, can we really afford to disengage with China?

MANALO: Well, that's why it's a challenge. Because it's complex. And I don't think any country, at least not me, I don't think the answer is disengagement. What you should really maybe do, what the Philippines is doing actually is ensuring that we have the resilience and adaptability in the event of any unforeseen, let's say, action taken by any country. That's why in many ways, our efforts to reach out to more and more partners, not only mga partners natin here in the region and not only the United States, but our partners, for example, Australia, New Zealand, Vietnam, Japan. We're reaching out to them especially in terms of a free trade arrangement with the EU. That will only strengthen our, if we reach agreement, and we've had good negotiations so far, if we reach agreement, that can only be a positive thing for our economy. And if the economy does well, then obviously your security is also developed. So that's the approach we take. At the same time, we maintain our economic relations with China where we can.

INTERVIEWER: Ano ang scope ng mga economic partnership sa China? Apart from being the number one trading partner, are we also pursuing high development investment like mga infrastruktura? Tuloy pa rin ba yun, sir? O medyo manirap in this kind of climate?

MANALO: Medyo nag-stop. Of course, we're not the agency involved necessarily in the government infrastructure projects. Trade-wise, it's continuing, of course. They still are, as I said, our number one partner. It's not as if we're closing our doors on that. There's still investment going on, but perhaps some of the projects have not worked out well. But that's because that's based on technical reasons. So, that's the situation. So, what I'm basically saying is, I mean, there's been no change in the economic policy. It's really more on the type of investments and how efficient they are. And in fact, if you can get investment, we're also open to other countries. So you choose the investment which is the most technically sound and the most financially feasible. It's based on economic factors.

INTERVIEWER: What happens, sir, to the joint oil and gas exploration that we're supposed to explore with China? Because I remember in your previous interview, you mentioned about a possible resumption of talks. Are we still doing it? Are we open to doing it? Anong status na ito, sir?

MANALO: Well, as far as I know, I think maybe in the private groups have been talking, but as far as the government level is concerned, we had some talks last year but unfortunately there was no agreement. So we haven't closed the door on possible talks in the future. But I think we have to bear in mind, in order for the talks to be successful, our positions have to be satisfied. Especially our legal conditions should be there, should be satisfied. So, I think we're open, but it still has to be negotiated.

INTERVIEWER: Always on the table?

MANALO: It's on the table, but of course, even if it's on the table, you have to reach an agreement.

INTERVIEWER: Now, shifting from one country to another, the United States, sir. The U.S. has approved the removal of the freeze order for at least 300 million US dollars na security aid sa Philippines, what is your reaction? And how does this reflect yung Philippine-US relations na na-exempt yung portion of the security aid for the Philippines?

MANALO: Well, I heard that news recently. But actually, it's our embassy in Washington which is working on and is in touch with the United States on the details, so I would rather defer their, any information on this, I would defer to our embassy in Washington. But all I can say is that, of course, if that were true, naturally, that would be of great benefit to the Philippines. And certainly, that's something that would be welcome, since we do benefit from that.

INTERVIEWER: Okay. But this was not brought up during your meeting with State Secretary Rubio in Germany, sir. When you had the chance to meet with him, did you raise a request to unfreeze it?

MANALO: No, we talked more in general terms. But he did mention to me that regarding some of these pronouncements the U.S. has made about freezing or discontinuing, he said there's always the possibility of exceptions. So we left it at that.

INTERVIEWER: But do you hope that it will expand beyond the security? Because ang dami pong na-affect din itong freeze order nila, di ba, sa humanitarian, education

MANALO: Oh, definitely. I hope that, in fact, in my discussions with Secretary Rubio on two occasions, we made it, we were agreed that we should focus a lot on the economic cooperation. Not only G2G, but also B2B and private sector cooperation. So, I think it appears that we will be focusing a lot now on how to promote economic cooperation. I mean, of course you'll have defense and security, but a lot now will be focused, will try and focus a lot on more economic cooperation because in the end, economic cooperation leads to greater economic security which leads to your also your security. So I think definitely that's one area that we will be concentrating on, at least from the Philippine perspective, how to enhance our economic cooperation in the broadest sense.

INTERVIEWER: Now that we are seeing a glimpse of the Trump policy directions, and based on your initial conversations with your counterpart and other government officials in the US, are you confident that the Philippines can count on Trump's America as a reliable ally?

MANALO: Well, based on my conversations and also what I've heard in terms of Yuma conversations of other officials in our government in the U.S., I think the Philippine-U.S. relationship may even become more enhanced or stronger, Especially as we are, as I mentioned earlier, we're thinking now we've been having more economic cooperation. And so that's certainly a good sign. And even on defense and security, I haven't heard anything that it would be less than what it is. So I think all in all, you're looking at a relationship that has good prospects. Good prospects. Well, if you want to say good prospects. Good prospects? Well, if you want to say bright prospects. Bright prospects, okay. And we were already bright before. So, brighter.

INTERVIEWER: Okay, Secretary, I want to go to speaking of defense, you've mentioned that the U.S. Typhoon missile because lagi rin po itong natatanong sa inyo China repeatedly calling for, sabi po nila, that we're backtracking from our previous statements and promises. There's a commentary on their state newspaper. Sinasabi po nila na, yun nga, we're backtracking from our words of removing the Typhoon missile. How would you respond to that call from China?

MANALO: Well, I think I had answered that before. First of all, the Typhoon missiles are not aimed at any country. They're there for our defense. And it's actually the DND which is dealing with the operational aspect. But in principle, they're really there for our defense. And therefore, I really can't understand the continuous concern being expressed by China on their use. When you consider that China has certainly many more missile oils than the Philippines. And I don't know where they're aimed at. So I think there might be a bit of an overreaction to the Typhoon missiles, which are clearly for defensive purposes. And the Philippines has absolutely no intention of directing them at any certain country, unless you're attacked. But that's why they're for defense.

INTERVIEWER: Okay. But one of their reasons, sir, is before, sinabi natin gagamitin lang for military exercises and now nakaparang strategic deployment na nakadeploy na siya strategically. Nag-iba ba yung ihip ng hangin natin, sir? Or talagang it's our prerogative?

MANALO: It's our prerogative kasi do we question what they do? And if we say it's for national defense, for security in general, every country has a right to defend itself as long as it doesn't use it for aggressive purposes. We abide by the UN Charter but nothing in the UN Charter says a country cannot defend itself or at least be ready to defend itself.We're not using it. So, I don't really understand why there's this deep concern on this when we've already mentioned it's not aimed at any country. And we don't criticize what they do. We don't criticize what other countries do. They wish to build up their defenses. We never criticize.

INTERVIEWER: Okay. Before I leave you this topic on the U.S., sir, the U.S. also changed its position in the Russian invasion of Ukraine, somehow shifting towards a more neutral stance. Are we also looking at changing our stance or we are maintaining our position on the Russian invasion of Ukraine?

MANALO: Well, we maintained our, on the last resolution, we maintained. The US resolution was basically calling for peace. So there's nothing inconsistent with that. So that was consistent with the overall Ukraine approach. But as far as we're concerned, we still support the basic fundamental principles of international law and the UN Charter. And on that basis, we supported the conflict in Ukraine. But at the same time, we also respect what the US did, their resolution. And as I said, their resolution was fundamentally sound because it basically called for peace.And that, in my view at least, was like the EU in many ways, the EU statement. So, we have partners in the EU and we have partners in the US.So, that's how we approach the issue.

INTERVIEWER: ASEAN, sir. First, ASEAN 2025 and ASEAN 2026. Yung ASEAN muna, sir, this year in Malaysia, are you optimistic that there will be significant progress? Lalo na po sa code of conduct na lagi po natin pinag-follow up.

MANALO: Well, let me just say we will do our best to move the negotiations and the code of conduct forward. Yan ang main aim naman namin. Negotiations too, and as it's been said many times, this is not just simply a negotiation between ASEAN and China. It's basically the ASEAN members and China. So you're looking at 11 countries. So you have to put that perspective. You have 11 negotiators, so each one has its basic position.

MANALO: Of course, ASEAN countries have some similar positions. But probably what we would also like to happen is that we begin also to look seriously at some particular issues which have not yet been sufficiently discussed. And these are the milestone issues, they're called. So we'll see whether we can discuss them also in the upcoming negotiations. But we're fully committed to supporting the negotiations and we'll be working behind our ASEAN chairman during the next round.

INTERVIEWER: Okay. And for the ASEAN 2026 kung saan tayo ang mag-chair, ano po ang preparations na?

MANALO: Well, we're really beginning to prepare both substantively, logistically. But as for the specific details, I can't really go into them now because a lot will also depend on the situation towards the end of the Malaysian chairmanship. And we may have to see how to deal with any issues which remain unresolved at the end or towards the end of the Malaysian. And then, of course, we have our own ideas. But whatever they are, and I don't necessarily want to say them yet, but they will be consistent with promoting ASEAN centrality and also strengthening the ASEAN community and further ASEAN integration. So, yun ang basic parameters namin. And as for the specifics, I can't go into them yet, but that will be our basic approach. In addition to these other issues which have been outstanding for some years, we have to see where we stand towards the end of the chairmanship of Malaysia.

INTERVIEWER: Okay, high-level meeting, sir. Inaabangan po yung Trump-Marcos meeting. Are you confident that it will happen anytime soon?

MANALO: Well, we're hopeful that they will be there in discussion now, our embassy in Washington and here and looking towards a possible meeting and visit of the President, a meeting of the President with President Trump.

INTERVIEWER: All right, sir, UN Security Council did and Human Rights Council seat din ito yung dalawang pinupursue ng Philippines House are bid progressing.

MANALO: Our bid is progressing very well. And we in the council, especially because we feel that the Philippines possesses the, not only the necessary experience, but the qualification is to be a constructive member of the a nonpermanent member of the Security Council. We have a long history in the UN, and we are active in basic issues involving peace and security, whether they be economic or security or political. So, we think, of course, we're the most, we are the most qualified candidate of the, in the Asian group. So, we're working hard on this. We have one more year to campaign, and so we will be, focusing on that during the year.

INTERVIEWER: Okay. Before my last question, Sir, I just want to go back a bit doing defense and security because in recent months or years defense and security because in recent months or years and there may have been well and dominating agreements with other countries, like VFA with reciprocal access agreement with Japan, Then the New Zealand VFA katatapos lang nung talks, and then there are pending negotiation for France and Canada. So, bakit po ba bigla nagkakaroon ng increase in this kind of, agreements. And how helpful are these defense pacts to the Philippines?

MANALO: Well, you can call them defense pacts, but there are also cooperation, like cooperation of, interoperability of, military forces or even more, dealing military forces or even more, dealing with humanitarian issues, joint operations, exchanges of officials. So it's, a very broad range of cooperation. I think it reflects the fact that many the countries that we have entered into face, have similar views as us on the importance of given the uncertainties, geopolitical uncertainties, it's important that countries, partner with each other not only in, of course, on economic cooperation, but also on the defense security measures were possible. And the fact that we are, entering through these arrangements, shows that not only Philippines but even the countries we, enter into those arrangements also have similar perspective. So it's I think this is really more of an effort to, address the, as I mentioned, the geopolitical uncertainties in our world. And, we are in that stage, apparently. So, our view is that the best thing is work with your friends and work with your partners wherever you can.

INTERVIEWER: Okay, so three years or midway through the Marcos administration, and as DFA chief, ano pa po ba yung reforms na gusto niyong mangyari within the department?

MANALO:  Well, I think, first of all, I'm very proud of the, DFA personnel. I think, they are doing a great job and that we have, certainly, as DFA, we are faced with many challenges ourselves, whether they be consular or dealing with, with political issues or even economic issues. We're somehow involved, especially if there is a foreign component, involved. I think, what I, and really happy about is just maintaining the spirit of trying to help the country help our people. And I think, that spirit is there. And the real issue now is to sustain it. But I'm confident that we will.

INTERVIEWER: Foreign Affairs Secretary Enrique Manalo, sir, thank you for granting this interview. Maraming salamat.

MANALO: Thank you. Thank you Tristan.

INTERVIEWER: We will continue to deliver just the facts and the news you need, I am Tristan Nodalo until our next newsmaker, you're watching NewsWatch Plus.